Chinese Want to Build Railway - PP to Santiago - Where do You Stand?

[sosuaman]

Is this something that is automatically agreed to? Because it sounds so fantastic?
Huge money into the area.
The ability to hop on this train and get to Santiago in about 30 mins! Sweet!
Lots of jobs for those that live there.
It's a no brainer, right?
But.....

This would be a huge undertaking and require a tremendous amount of space, hence destroying anything and everything in its way.

Once the Chinese sink their teeth into this beautiful paradise, they aren't gonna let go. This project would be the first of many such projects they will want to do and probably will get done - because they have the money, plenty of money.

But is this the best thing for the Dominican Republic?

Having these railways scattered throughout the country? And as the article states - they expect a huge influx of Chinese pouring into the country following their investment so to speak. Also giving a fine sight from above looking like an amusement ride stretching its way around the country. It seems like they would be taking some of the "jungle" out of the Dominican. Taking it into the next century, modernizing the DR.

What are your thoughts?

Good thing? Bad thing? Indifferent? :)

http://www.sosuanews.com/index.php?id=3084&article=1

[deezl]

What are your thoughts?


I think it'll work out something like this. Plans get approved. China pumps a shitload of money into the project to start things off. Most of the money disappears. China says "What the fuck?" DR shrugs its shoulders. China says "Fuck this" and goes home.

[psriches]

Like the one in the Capital? Yeah, how'd that work out?

Why not ask China to help out with the education system?

This country should just rot and sink into the sea.

(except for the bitches)

[SeaWeed]

usually what happens is the Plans get approved.......Politicians and someone from China shows up to break ground.......China pumps a shitload of money into the construction project...... taking a lot longer to complete the project than originally thought.........everybody is pointing fingers at each other........ there are cost overruns....... someone goes on strike or contractor(s) pulls off the job.....instead of 4 years the project takes 8 years or twice as long as expected.....and the Politicians and DR government argue about who is to blame.....then the Politicians and someone from China shows up in Santiago to open up their new rail system........Santiago becomes the mongering capital of the DR when all the mongers are jumping on the train from PP........Sosua becomes filled with families and kids from the new AI's that sprout up......and the taxi union mafia goes on strike cause they aren't getting enough business on the Santiago to PP run cause of the new rail system......

[Irie]

.....or your ho from Santiago only shows up 52 min late instead of an hour because of the marvels of rail transit. :rolleyes:


Yeah......and say goodbye to moto or taxi fare requests in the morning.....

[yayow]

I personally think it's a great idea, and I hope it goes through. Would improve travel between Santiago and Puerto Plata/ Sosua I am all for it. I have been on the "subway" in Santo Domingo a few times and think it is a great thing, works well, is one of the cleanest ones I have been on (of course I am from NYC so it probably doesn't count when compared to subways in other large cities and countries) actually thinking about it I loved subways systems everywhere I've been compared to NY, Montreal and a few other cities.

Hope it gets done!!!! But not holding my breath !!!!

[psriches]

I personally think it's a great idea, and I hope it goes through. Would improve travel between Santiago and Puerto Plata/ Sosua I am all for it. I have been on the "subway" in Santo Domingo a few times and think it is a great thing, works well, is one of the cleanest ones I have been on (of course I am from NYC so it probably doesn't count when compared to subways in other large cities and countries) actually thinking about it I loved subways systems everywhere I've been compared to NY, Montreal and a few other cities.

Hope it gets done!!!! But not holding my breath !!!!But does everyone ride and benefit from the subway in the Capital the way they do in NYC?? Or is it just a select group?

[jose1234]

I'm all for it... Really can't think of any negatives. The country needs it to progress. There will be Dominican hobos...

[yayow]

But does everyone ride and benefit from the subway in the Capital the way they do in NYC?? Or is it just a select group?


No they don't! Really it was poor design, it helps a few, but in my opinion it would have been more beneficial in the capital if it was a east/west system going along the route that Ave Independencia goes as opposed to the North/South route they chose. Of course another thing to consider is if they had a east/west route it would put way more guaguas and fast cars out of business, and they really don't want to do that just yet.

But Santiago to Puerto Plata wouldn't really effect the little guy, it would effect Caribe Tours and Metro much more, don't know if they want to do that either.

[TNT72]

I'm all for it... Really can't think of any negatives. The country needs it to progress. There will be Dominican hobos...

The problem is, all the greed that will pop up! Everyone....EVERYONE will be looking to get their hands on some of the money, for doing nothing.

ohmmmm, how many people shook you down on your remodel. Yeah, I know it was small, so you didn't have the power of politicians in SD to protect you. But a project this big, those same politicians in SD, Santiago, and PP will be the worst ones. Wanting payoffs, and putting their useless family members on the projects......just for everyone to say "es no mi culpa" when things go to shit!

[yayow]

I'm all for it... Really can't think of any negatives. The country needs it to progress. There will be Dominican hobos...


They already have plenty of those, but to tell you the truth if they run it the way they run it in the capital, there wouldn't be any hobos to be found in the system, good security at every station (police) and a few actually riding on it from the first stop to the last, haven't heard of any horror stories on the system as of yet.

[yayow]

The problem is, all the greed that will pop up! Everyone....EVERYONE will be looking to get their hands on some of the money, for doing nothing.

ohmmmm, how many people shook you down on your remodel. Yeah, I know it was small, so you didn't have the power of politicians in SD to protect you. But a project this big, those same politicians in SD, Santiago, and PP will be the worst ones. Wanting payoffs, and putting their useless family members on the projects......just for everyone to say "es no mi culpa" when things go to shit!


You make a good point here, there will always be some corruption, but the alternative is status quo, and progress at even the risk of some getting unduly rich, is worth it, no?

[yayow]

If you could make the trip from Santiago to Puerto Plata in half the time at the same price, is it worth it. How about if you could get from the capital to Puerto Plata in 2 hours instead of 5 for 700 pesos would that be worth it, all of a sudden the trip from NY or where ever wouldn't be a hinderance of your time and money if you flew into la capital and then took the trip from the capital to Puerto Plata or Sosua. So the cheaper fares would really be worth it, plus if a guy wanted to spend a day in the capital he could do it easy, hop on the subway, at 7 or 8 am, get there by 9 or 10 spend a few hours doing your business and be back in Sosua by dinner time, well worth it if you ask me, and for what un mil or un mil quilento.

[psriches]

If you could make the trip from Santiago to Puerto Plata in half the time at the same price, is it worth it. How about if you could get from the capital to Puerto Plata in 2 hours instead of 5 for 700 pesos would that be worth it, all of a sudden the trip from NY or where ever wouldn't be a hinderance of your time and money if you flew into la capital and then took the trip from the capital to Puerto Plata or Sosua. So the cheaper fares would really be worth it, plus if a guy wanted to spend a day in the capital he could do it easy, hop on the subway, at 7 or 8 am, get there by 9 or 10 spend a few hours doing your business and be back in Sosua by dinner time, well worth it if you ask me, and for what un mil or un mil quilento.Don't forget the 1100 peso taxi from the airport to the train station.

[knotty]

since there is not much detail in that article. i hope it does not become like most chinese projects in other countries they do business with. they normally bring their own chinese workers to do the project.

[Skynyrd]

If you could make the trip from Santiago to Puerto Plata in half the time at the same price, is it worth it. How about if you could get from the capital to Puerto Plata in 2 hours instead of 5 for 700 pesos would that be worth it, all of a sudden the trip from NY or where ever wouldn't be a hinderance of your time and money if you flew into la capital and then took the trip from the capital to Puerto Plata or Sosua. So the cheaper fares would really be worth it, plus if a guy wanted to spend a day in the capital he could do it easy, hop on the subway, at 7 or 8 am, get there by 9 or 10 spend a few hours doing your business and be back in Sosua by dinner time, well worth it if you ask me, and for what un mil or un mil quilento.

I'm with Yayow on this one...living in Florida The only Airline flying into POP is American, don't ask me why JetBlue won't offer it but they don't...anyway American rapes me on that flight and I can catch JetBlue to Santo Domingo direct nonstop for almost 1/2 the price so I'd ride the train baby lol

[TNT72]

You make a good point here, there will always be some corruption, but the alternative is status quo, and progress at even the risk of some getting unduly rich, is worth it, no?

I'm all for moving forward. Just like Skynard and you, I hope it goes in. I can fly Spirit for half the price. I just don't like the 5 hour bus ride.

But, will the Chinese money start a feeding frenzy that will end up bleeding the Chinese until they say fuck it, and just abandon the project?

I haven't seen the subway in the capital, but I've seen roads that were just laid a couple weeks before, that got pot holes, because the contractor skimped on the concrete to save money. How does he get away with it? His high powered family member is the one that gave him the job, and will continue to do so, no matter how many projects he screws up. Especially since the contractor is kicking up to the powerful one.

Now we are talking about putting a train either over, or through, the mountains. Someone skimps at the wrong place, that could be a high death toll.

I'm happy to take the train if it goes in. I just won't be on the first few trips it takes.

[Irie]

I'm all for moving forward...........




TRUST US!.........we know.........:rofl::rofl::rofl:



http://news.insearchofchicas.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=57690&d=1347493680





Now we are talking about putting a train either over, or through, the mountains. Someone skimps at the wrong place, that could be a high death toll.

I'm happy to take the train if it goes in. I just won't be on the first few trips it takes.




I'm with you on this one T. Have you seen what the aftermath can be when they build sidewalks and curbs??????




http://news.insearchofchicas.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=57689&d=1347493680

[deezl]

I think it would actually make a lot more sense to build a railway from Santo Domingo to Santiago, but that would probably be the next step anyway.

[Señor JDR of Medellin]

Is this something that is automatically agreed to? Because it sounds so fantastic?
Huge money into the area.
The ability to hop on this train and get to Santiago in about 30 mins! Sweet!
Lots of jobs for those that live there.
It's a no brainer, right?
But.....


http://www.sosuanews.com/index.php?id=3084&article=1

But the taxi mafia runs everything. They would be crushed.

[TNT72]

TRUST US!.........we know.........:rofl::rofl::rofl:



Click to see pic (http://news.insearchofchicas.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=57690&d=1347493680)









I'm with you on this one T. Have you seen what the aftermath can be when they build sidewalks and curbs??????




Click to see pic (http://news.insearchofchicas.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=57689&d=1347493680)


What can I say?????

I believe in moving forward! No matter the cost!:rolleyes:

[DCIronman]

usually what happens is the Plans get approved.......Politicians and someone from China shows up to break ground.......China pumps a shitload of money into the construction project...... taking a lot longer to complete the project than originally thought.........everybody is pointing fingers at each other........ there are cost overruns....... someone goes on strike or contractor(s) pulls off the job.....instead of 4 years the project takes 8 years or twice as long as expected.....and the Politicians and DR government argue about who is to blame.....then the Politicians and someone from China shows up in Santiago to open up their new rail system........Santiago becomes the mongering capital of the DR when all the mongers are jumping on the train from PP........Sosua becomes filled with families and kids from the new AI's that sprout up......and the taxi union mafia goes on strike cause they aren't getting enough business on the Santiago to PP run cause of the new rail system......

I agree with most of your post. But trust me, the highlighted isn't likely to happen.

I love Santiago and currently log in most of my time in country there. But anyone who spends quite a bit of time in Santiago will tell you that there really isn't much there that will support a major tourist industry. Santiaguerros are a little more conservative than their bretheren in La Capital. It's just not as tourist friendly. It's relatively problematic making any headway there unless you speak the language. Any sort of beach is too far away. And there's relatively little point-and-click mongering.

These are the some of the factors, not access, that really limit tourist traffic to Santiago. It's already a relatively short bus/taxi/drive from POP. And it's cheaper to fly into STI than POP. If Santiago had the potential to replace Sosua as the top DR tourist mongering destination, there would already be thousands of mongers flocking there. But the reality is that the majority of mongers who fly into STI are on their way to the North coast.

I'm pretty sure that the the railway would be mostly used by locals traveling between the two cities, and mongers headed to the North coast. And to be honest, that's perfectly fine for Santiago lovers like me.:corky:

[jonblaze]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2168507/Footage-shows-brand-new-Angolan-city-designed-500-000-lying-empty.html

Seems to me the Chinese should maybe consider spending a little money on the poor in their own country. Or come up with ways to help out that actually make sense. The above link explains what I mean. Also the link below for footage


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNOsT0yGx70

[dr1lvr]

Is this something that is automatically agreed to? Because it sounds so fantastic?
Huge money into the area.
The ability to hop on this train and get to Santiago in about 30 mins! Sweet!
Lots of jobs for those that live there.
It's a no brainer, right?
But.....

This would be a huge undertaking and require a tremendous amount of space, hence destroying anything and everything in its way.

Once the Chinese sink their teeth into this beautiful paradise, they aren't gonna let go. This project would be the first of many such projects they will want to do and probably will get done - because they have the money, plenty of money.

But is this the best thing for the Dominican Republic?

Having these railways scattered throughout the country? And as the article states - they expect a huge influx of Chinese pouring into the country following their investment so to speak. Also giving a fine sight from above looking like an amusement ride stretching its way around the country. It seems like they would be taking some of the "jungle" out of the Dominican. Taking it into the next century, modernizing the DR.

What are your thoughts?

Good thing? Bad thing? Indifferent? :)

http://www.sosuanews.com/index.php?id=3084&article=1

Would be much better if they put that $$$ into Education and the current roads (or lack thereof) in the country.

[questner]

It is a hoax. I almost guarantee it.

Chinese don't spend money unless there is a substantial profit behind it. Whatever they do in Africa and Latin America always has got a commercial project behind it in mining or transportation like in Panama.

As for the railway, it is much more viable in Brazil, still there are no railways in Brazil.

There is not enough demand for a railway project between PP and SDLC. What make sense is a toll highway. Even toll highway probably will cost a quarter billion.

Then who will guarantee the project? What the financing costs mainly interest will be? How much will cost to maintain it? Who will maintain it?

Do you recall the story with teleferico maintenance and repair? Everything has to be imported from Europe. The metro is SD operates at a loss and is subsidized.

Again, gimme that $ and I will figure out how to guarantee loans for a nuke power plant which will benefit both DR and Haiti and is absolutely necessary to transform the island.

[MrHappy]

I
I haven't seen the subway in the capital, but I've seen roads that were just laid a couple weeks before, that got pot holes, because the contractor skimped on the concrete to save money. How does he get away with it? His high powered family member is the one that gave him the job, and will continue to do so, no matter how many projects he screws up. Especially since the contractor is kicking up to the powerful one.


The money is in the asphalt, big guy.


I think it would actually make a lot more sense to build a railway from Santo Domingo to Santiago, but that would probably be the next step anyway.

That's already in the works. The main reason for that route is to move freight and finished goods from the Free Zones to the port for shipment, people would be secondary. Meant to be a union buster.(truckers)



There is not enough demand for a railway project between PP and SDLC. What make sense is a toll highway. Even toll highway probably will cost a quarter billion.


The conversion of the PP-Navarette-Santiago highway to a toll highway is already underway.

The main reason for a railway from PP to Santiago would be for freight as well. Do you know how much freight is moved through Puerto Plata? Lots.

There is also a new cruise ship terminal being built in Maimon. Tourists on those ships could do a short hop into Puerto Plata for touristy stuff.

BTW, the Metro in Santo Domingo was never meant to be a money maker. It was built to improve mass transit, which is currently a nightmare. The city desperately needs a mass transit system.

Everyone used to say that the metro would be worthless, but now everybody is complaining that it's not big enough. What a change.

The second line East/west is supposed to be done by the end of this year. Here's what it should look like when it's done:

http://us.santo-domingo-live.com/upload/map-metro-santo-domingo.jpg

The entire country is undertaking a "National Master Plan" to improve transportation options.

[jose1234]

Seems that the current government figured out they have no money. Danilo is cutting this and that and many supporters are upset. But, if he can come up with some major projects to help the country that costs no money and no debt, such as a toll road or railroad built by foreigners, then he can show that his policies are working and benefiting people. Everything in this country is for show and appearances...not the truth. Some big projects will look good. I dink...

[DMV]

Wasn't there a rail system back in the trujilo day? I agree with Mr Happy it will break the hold of the truckers that have strong hold on how products are moved.

[MrHappy]

Wasn't there a rail system back in the trujilo day? I agree with Mr Happy it will break the hold of the truckers that have strong hold on how products are moved.

Yep, from Puerto Plata to La Vega. Trujillo had it torn up due to dissidents....

Puerto Plata has always been the main harbour for Cibao, and thus for Santiago and surrounding areas. The dictator Ulises Heureaux (Lilis) opened the route between Moca and Puerto Plata in 1897.

The harbour town became a transfer-harbour for the local area, and exported tropical wood, cigars, tobacco, rum and sugar. When the dictator Trujillo came to power during the 1930s, he encountered a lot of opposition from the important families in the harbour town, so he punished Puerto Plata by dismantling the railway line in 1952, to the fury of those with their own sugar plantations.

[mho]

The Chinese want resources not pussy. This article is a joke.

[questner]

The money is in the asphalt, big guy.



That's already in the works. The main reason for that route is to move freight and finished goods from the Free Zones to the port for shipment, people would be secondary. Meant to be a union buster.(truckers)



The conversion of the PP-Navarette-Santiago highway to a toll highway is already underway.

The main reason for a railway from PP to Santiago would be for freight as well. Do you know how much freight is moved through Puerto Plata? Lots.

There is also a new cruise ship terminal being built in Maimon. Tourists on those ships could do a short hop into Puerto Plata for touristy stuff.

BTW, the Metro in Santo Domingo was never meant to be a money maker. It was built to improve mass transit, which is currently a nightmare. The city desperately needs a mass transit system.

Everyone used to say that the metro would be worthless, but now everybody is complaining that it's not big enough. What a change.

The second line East/west is supposed to be done by the end of this year. Here's what it should look like when it's done:

http://us.santo-domingo-live.com/upload/map-metro-santo-domingo.jpg

The entire country is undertaking a "National Master Plan" to improve transportation options.

Question is there a need to put freight on a high speed rail? Nope.

Is there a need in a railroad from Maimon to an aquarium to play with freaking dolphins from 7 am to 2 pm when the ships are docked? Nope.

I will leave political implications aside, what's 50 years anyway...

[steviewonder]

It will be done sooner then later, and for the reasons MyHappy has said. In the south they do this with sugar cane, and here in the north they will do it for 40 ft container loads, import and export loads, especially from the free zones. IMO in the beginning passengers will not be the focus with the rail system from POP and back:wink:

[swiggy]

The Chinese arent going to come in foolish and doe-eyed. They will already have solved most of the problems that will occur, and they will know what will occur. And they didnt just wake up and say "fuck it lets build a railroad for these greedy, corrupt, unappreciative assholes". They are doing it to make money on something. lots of things are made in DR, so who knows what they have up their sleeve.

[yayow]

.......Again, gimme that $ and I will figure out how to guarantee loans for a nuke power plant which will benefit both DR and Haiti and is absolutely necessary to transform the island.


Damn the way most on this board feel about Dominicans, and you want them to think about a nuclear power plant run by Dominicans. Did you see what happened in Japan?????????

[deezl]

The Chinese arent going to come in foolish and doe-eyed. They will already have solved most of the problems that will occur, and they will know what will occur. And they didnt just wake up and say "fuck it lets build a railroad for these greedy, corrupt, unappreciative assholes". They are doing it to make money on something. lots of things are made in DR, so who knows what they have up their sleeve.

Maybe they're trying to work the sugar cane market, since China is growing and gas supplies are dwindling everyone's going to have to start looking into more sustainable fuels, and ethanol from sugarcane is a big one (just ask Brazil). You need the right climate and land to grow it and DR has both, it may be the best natural resource left in the DR.

[DMV]

Maybe they're trying to work the sugar cane market, since China is growing and gas supplies are dwindling everyone's going to have to start looking into more sustainable fuels, and ethanol from sugarcane is a big one (just ask Brazil). You need the right climate and land to grow it and DR has both, it may be the best natural resource left in the DR.


Did you read about the sugar in DR from Brazil. It had sand in it. Strange story because as you pointed out DR grows alot, why imprort it? Has to hurt the local guy.

[yayow]

In my opinion progress for he most part, is good, no matter what the reasons behind it. Now will some that are currently doing business, suffer of course, that always is going to happen when you change or put in new innovations, it's inevitable.

Progress is also good in this instance because we are not just talking about your local neighborhood, but things that will effect a whole country, and how they operate in the future, I am all for it, as far as your original question goes.

If the Dominican Republic is going to progress, they need a strong and dependable rail system, every industrial country in the world has one, so if they want to progress, they will need one as well. Baby steps, but steps none the less have to be taken. Can't compare this country to the US, and in my opinion one of the things that many foreigners and new ex - pats are constantly doing, if you make that comparison, it will always continued to be looked down upon. Unless you compare it to the US at another point in it's history. Some call it a third world country, I always considered it a second world country, I know it's just semantics, but it's a way to look at it, and it's place in the world in my opinion.

[Orange]

First off, the Chinese are not so generous that they want to build a new railway system out of the goodness of their heart.

What's going to happen is what happened in Costa Rica. The Chinese offered to build them a national soccer stadium in san Jose. The Costa Ricans agreed. And now a couple of years later, Costa Rica is China's bitch.

In case you are wondering what happened in between... China brought in 600 Chinese workers from home (no jobs for Costa Ricans-all Chinese labor) and built the fucking thing in no time (they had 3 shifts going 24 hours a day). They lived in a dorm onsite. In exchange for their generous "gift", China now enjoys duty-free imports into Costa Rica. So more of their cheap plastic lead paint garbage is being peddled throughout the country. And now Costa Rica has agreed to build Barrio Chino (Chinatown) in the middle of downtown. It's almost done, ETA is mid-December.

So basically, it gave China free entrance into the CR market, and did nothing to improve the economy or well-being of Costa Ricans. They now sarcastically call their country "Costa China". They are pissed at the way their government sold the country out.

[sosuaman]

And now a couple of years later, Costa Rica is China's bitch.

exactly.....

[yayow]

By that logic the US is China's bitch as well, if you look at how much the US owes them.

At some point your Country has to have some faith in the people who govern it, and make those decisions, obviously those in Costa Rica, didn't do the right thing by their Country, if the DR does the same they deserve what they get, up to the new President and his people to do it in a way which will benefit their Country. Just because one Country fucked up with their negotiations, that means that all other countries, will as well? If your neighbor attempts to build a small business in your neighborhood and is a total failure, and you have an idea for a business, you should abandon it, because your neighbor fucked up? Or should you believe in yourself, get the best possible advice and move forward with your dreams, regardless of what happened to his neighbor's dreams.

Of course I realize that I am betting on the Dominican Republic's gov't which is historically a bad bet, but it's needed, and maybe they will get it right. Then again maybe not!

[Sidney]

A better, faster, cheaper solution would be to fill the thousands of potholes and build truck pull offs for the existing Ruta.:smile: The current ruta is a national disgrace:mad::mad:. Forget the Chinese.:icontd: Build hydro and windmills for DR's power needs.:smile: As is available and if economic, import cheap natural gas liquids.:smile::smile::smile:

[yayow]

A better, faster, cheaper solution would be to fill the thousands of potholes and build truck pull offs for the existing Ruta.:smile: The current ruta is a national disgrace:mad::mad:. Forget the Chinese.:icontd: Build hydro and windmills for DR's power needs.:smile: As is available and if economic, import cheap natural gas liquids.:smile::smile::smile:


Actually I agree with much of what you say in this post Sidney, I agree they don't really need the Chinese, don't know why they are involved at all. Although the infrasructure is not the best it has improved quite a bit, since I have been in country, they have built some really good roadways, in Santo Domingo and in other locations, they need more no doubt. But because they have done the other roadways and railways, they have already proven they have the ability, so why include the Chinese, much be more to that, I am sure if the Chinese are involved, they are giving the Gov't substantial loans with a generous payback schedule, and part of the deal is to allow the Chinese get involved in something like this.

As far as hydro or windmill power, plus some others possible sources I have heard of, I feel much better about those sources of energy as opposed to nuclear power, not comfortable with that, and if they instituted something like that on such a relativily small island, that could be a deal breaker for someone like myself, that shit is dangerous. Although I obviously understand the need for more efficient and reliable energy in the country, I would prefer it to stay about the same as opposed to nuclear energy, that shit just scares me.

[questner]

Damn the way most on this board feel about Dominicans, and you want them to think about a nuclear power plant run by Dominicans. Did you see what happened in Japan?????????

Four dominicans will play merengue at the gates.

As for Japan, yes, all Japan is prone to quakes. Sooner or later they will rebuild modern plants inside the country further away from the shoreline.

[knotty]

First off, the Chinese are not so generous that they want to build a new railway system out of the goodness of their heart.

What's going to happen is what happened in Costa Rica. The Chinese offered to build them a national soccer stadium in san Jose. The Costa Ricans agreed. And now a couple of years later, Costa Rica is China's bitch.

In case you are wondering what happened in between... China brought in 600 Chinese workers from home (no jobs for Costa Ricans-all Chinese labor) and built the fucking thing in no time (they had 3 shifts going 24 hours a day). They lived in a dorm onsite. In exchange for their generous "gift", China now enjoys duty-free imports into Costa Rica. So more of their cheap plastic lead paint garbage is being peddled throughout the country. And now Costa Rica has agreed to build Barrio Chino (Chinatown) in the middle of downtown. It's almost done, ETA is mid-December.

So basically, it gave China free entrance into the CR market, and did nothing to improve the economy or well-being of Costa Ricans. They now sarcastically call their country "Costa China". They are pissed at the way their government sold the country out.
this is exactly what I was thinking earlier. That China will most likely use their on labor instead of the locals. They have done this often wherever they go. At the end of the day, China will benefit.

[knotty]

By that logic the US is China's bitch as well, if you look at how much the US owes them.

At some point your Country has to have some faith in the people who govern it, and make those decisions, obviously those in Costa Rica, didn't do the right thing by their Country, if the DR does the same they deserve what they get, up to the new President and his people to do it in a way which will benefit their Country. Just because one Country fucked up with their negotiations, that means that all other countries, will as well? If your neighbor attempts to build a small business in your neighborhood and is a total failure, and you have an idea for a business, you should abandon it, because your neighbor fucked up? Or should you believe in yourself, get the best possible advice and move forward with your dreams, regardless of what happened to his neighbor's dreams.

Of course I realize that I am betting on the Dominican Republic's gov't which is historically a bad bet, but it's needed, and maybe they will get it right. Then again maybe not!

Technically no. The US is not really China's bitch. One can't really live without the other. The US wants cheap shit to buy, and China needs the US to buy them. They are both intertwined into one another.

[MrHappy]

A better, faster, cheaper solution would be to fill the thousands of potholes and build truck pull offs for the existing Ruta.:smile: The current ruta is a national disgrace:mad::mad:. Forget the Chinese.:icontd: Build hydro and windmills for DR's power needs.:smile: As is available and if economic, import cheap natural gas liquids.:smile::smile::smile:

That's in the works.

The route from Navarette to Puerto Plata is going to be privatized, widened, and converted to a toll road.

Don't you read the news, Sidney?