You don't say?!?!?!?!?!!!!

[JuanElGriego]

6BEsZMvrq-I (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6BEsZMvrq-I)

[David Smash]

So Dick Cheney got DUMBER in about 10yrs. You know Condi Rice was singing the same song in March 2001.

[knotty]

just a bunch of puppets.

[PapiQueRico]

Jon Stewart was playing with this clip tonight on the Daily Show. Very funny if it weren't o fucking sad!

[scoochamenz1]

(with tongue planted firmly in cheek) but, but, aren't we there to install democracy in the middle east and fight the war on terror on their own soil instead of ours? i mean, we can't be there to steal the oil, what kind of country would that make us?

[JuanElGriego]

http://foxattacks.com/iran?utm_source=rgemail

[scoochamenz1]

the question is when, not if we'll be going into iran. the networks will follow like the sheep that they are. everyone talks about the liberal press, i'd sure like to see where it is. all these "news" outlets beat the corporate and political drums that send someone else's kids into harms way so we can keep driving our hummers and escalades. on a selfish note, i'm just glad i'm an old, fat guy, cause when the draft is inevitably brought back, they won't come looking for guys like me.

[PapiQueRico]

the question is when, not if we'll be going into iran. the networks will follow like the sheep that they are. everyone talks about the liberal press, i'd sure like to see where it is. all these "news" outlets beat the corporate and political drums that send someone else's kids into harms way so we can keep driving our hummers and escalades. on a selfish note, i'm just glad i'm an old, fat guy, cause when the draft is inevitably brought back, they won't come looking for guys like me.

Don't worry, there wont be a draft. There is no way they could get away with a college deferment any more, and a draft would force the children of privilage to fight. We saw how quickly the war in Vietnam ended once the children of lawyers and doctors and Wall Street types were eligible to be drafted and their parents joined in the marches against the war. The last thing those who want to continue fighting want is a draft. It might be the only thing that would wake this country up!

[scoochamenz1]

ther'll be a draft, there are still plenty of lower middle class and poor people out there with no jobs. i wouldn't be surprised if all of a sudden an amnesty bill passed for illegals just before the draft is talked about in earnest. i have no faith in the government, especially these psychopaths and nothing would surprise me anymore.

[3somefan]

I'm sure glad we are all Americans and have the rights to speak in a open public forum about our leadership like this!

The crazy things is not Fox, CNN, Dick Cheney, Hillary Clinton or me and you had the lone vote to go to war...All of OUR legislature did it!! (Dems and Republicans)

[Tomr929]

How very true. However, some of them voted because of the party line While others voted that way because they were manipulated and lied to by a leadership that had a different agenda

[PapiQueRico]

I'm sure glad we are all Americans and have the rights to speak in a open public forum about our leadership like this!

The crazy things is not Fox, CNN, Dick Cheney, Hillary Clinton or me and you had the lone vote to go to war...All of OUR legislature did it!! (Dems and Republicans)

Excuse me, our legislature did not vote to go to war. Congress voted to give the President the power, the authority, in specific circumstances, to make the decision to go to war. This is far from the same thing.

[3somefan]

Excuse me, our legislature did not vote to go to war. Congress voted to give the President the power, the authority, in specific circumstances, to make the decision to go to war. This is far from the same thing.

I'm sorry that I don't agree with you here Papi. The President went to war with Iraq and Afghanistan with the full support of the United States Congress.

I don't want to get into a huge political debate with you or anyone on the board for that matter. I respect your opinion and humbly disagree. I guess the point I was trying to get across above, was that as Americans, we have the rights fought for in wars to have our opinions and to be able to discuss them openly without being hauled to jail or being persecuted. Thank God for that.:)

[JD426]

3 some, I could not agree with you more. thanks.
The timeline is conveniently somewhat forgotten here. Hint, what had not happened yet 10 years ago, or in march of 2001 ?
I could show you plenty of clips on BOTH sides of the Isle of contradictory statements ,several years apart. Do I like Cheney, hell no. But dont show me clips like that in itself is supposed to prove something to me. BTW, Jon Stewart is entertaining,thats all.
Situations change,strategies change. Maybe you have not see the news RECENTLY, but immediately after Iran made those statements of possibly taking over Iraq If and when it implodes, Sadir immediately halted all attacks on coalition forces, indefinitely. Did Anyone else think that was interesting??
That prick Sadir might even become one of our Allies, in the long term, who knows,because he doesnt want Iraq to get into it with Iran either. Its always been about the oil $$,otherwise noone would give 2 shits .

[3somefan]

jd426...

Exactly, we could look at sound bites from both sides of the aisle where politicians have changed their views, or contradicted themselves. In ten years, many things can change to make the government rethink their policies. Many politicians are now jumping on the bandwagon and saying that they were lied to or forced into supporting the war...how convenient! They all had the same information (whether correct or not,) and all had the ability to make their own decisions.

I too agree that alot of the reason for us being there is because of the oil. However, I do think that are some sincere people in our government, and especially in our military, that want to liberate Iraq and Afghanistan. I read and hear alot of stories from the soldiers in those countries that talk about how rewarding it is when they accomplish good things for the people there.

JMHO :)

[PapiQueRico]

I'm sorry that I don't agree with you here Papi. The President went to war with Iraq and Afghanistan with the full support of the United States Congress.

I don't want to get into a huge political debate with you or anyone on the board for that matter. I respect your opinion and humbly disagree. I guess the point I was trying to get across above, was that as Americans, we have the rights fought for in wars to have our opinions and to be able to discuss them openly without being hauled to jail or being persecuted. Thank God for that.:)

Three some, this is not a matter of opinion or political debate, but simple fact. The President went to Congress and asked for an authorization to use force if he deemed necessary, and if specific conditions existed. That is exactly what was voted on and approved.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2002/10/20021002-2.html

If the President had wanted the decision to be shared with the Congress he would have asked for a declaration of war. The decision to invade was the Presidents and his alone. Simply having the authority to use force neither means you must, or that it is prudent.

I stand on making this distinction because if we want to participate in our national decision making process we need to be well informed about what is happening or has happened. For me this is not a Republican/Democrat matter. A pox on both their houses. One party hasn't had a creative idea in 30 years and the other has a new idea every other day and they all suck!

Now this part will be political. If you think you have such rights to express yourself without being hauled off to jail, try to attend a Bush rally with an anti Bush T-shirt on!

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2006-07-23-bush-protesters_x.htm

[3somefan]

Three some, this is not a matter of opinion or political debate, but simple fact. The President went to Congress and asked for an authorization to use force if he deemed necessary, and if specific conditions existed. That is exactly what was voted on and approved.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2002/10/20021002-2.html

If the President had wanted the decision to be shared with the Congress he would have asked for a declaration of war. The decision to invade was the Presidents and his alone. Simply having the authority to use force neither means you must, or that it is prudent.

I stand on making this distinction because if we want to participate in our national decision making process we need to be well informed about what is happening or has happened. For me this is not a Republican/Democrat matter. A pox on both their houses. One party hasn't had a creative idea in 30 years and the other has a new idea every other day and they all suck!

Now this part will be political. If you think you have such rights to express yourself without being hauled off to jail, try to attend a Bush rally with an anti Bush T-shirt on!

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2006-07-23-bush-protesters_x.htm

Papi...I would like to apologize as I believe what you are saying is more accurate! Your distinction is correct.

I was just stating that (like you said above,) that both parties gave approval for these wars.

I don't believe that I am either a Democrat or a Republican, as I see and agree with beliefs on both sides. I may not agree with the President on some issues, however I do have respect for his office in general and and for him personally. The reason for my respect for him, is that he has stood behind his decisions (whether they be right or wrong,).

[scoochamenz1]

adolph in germany stood behind his decisions too, what does that prove? i don't even blame bush totally, he's merely the puppet having his strings pulled by those around him. i, personally, have a bit more respect for someone who can say, you know what? i fucked up, what do i have to do to fix it? not that any politician ever would. to constantly say i'm right, you're wrong, fuck you, you're not a true american, is really kinda scary. to me there aren't even two parties anymore, it's the demopublicans and it's all just a big game to them. how can my frat get power and keep it, while keeping the american public worrying about michael vick instead of the things that really matter. i edited ****** because of the ******. lol.